Mr. Shanfield, Einstein and Free Parking
I already submitted a short letter to the editor but would like to expand on it here
Today’s Windsor Star commentary is yet another sign of the challenges we have to face. It reminds me of one sign hanging inside of Shanfields’ store that gets seldom recognition
Great Spirits often encounter fierce opposition from mediocre minds - Albert Einstein
Mr. Shanfield is someone I greatly respect, at one time I affectionately referred to him as uncle Jack out of admiration. However, that doesn’t mean I agree with him on certain topics.
Mr. Shanfield is someone that needs to be listened too, he has taught me a lot and many times he has proven my faith in administration’s goodwill to be wrong.(see *** for example)
Lets respond to Mr. Van der Dolen’s points
1. Free parking
Parking fees serve a purpose far greater than tax collection. Their primary purpose is supposed to be the turnover highly prized parking spaces.
We tried Free parking at the DWBIA, I even supported it because after a few years of having to listen to Jack support it I said, what the heck, the guy deserves to have this tried simply for the dues he’s paid over the years.
Now many of us know what happened. No one could park for one month due to gov’t workers and employees taking the much coveted spots. The merchants that remained were sharpening their pitchforks when discussing the DWBIA.
Mr. Shanfield blames the DWBIA and city for not coordinating Parking Enforcement officers in an attempt to chalk tires and ticket based on a 2 hour rule.
Problem with this is you can’t get Parking enforcement officers to consistently chalk tires in the best of times
I’ve proposed solutions to the DWBIA and even a new one that has not yet been presented to the city.
1. Tiered parking rates - Main streets have a higher rate than outside areas. No reason to charge the same to park at a meter in front of the Art Gallery as on Ouellette
2. Voluntary Compliance - the City of Calgary has a written policy for when you catch a Parking enforcement officer in the immediate area when writing a ticket. He/she must cancel the ticket under one condition, you are nice to them and you smile. Talk about a game changer
3. Graduated parking tickets. Why does your 10th parking ticket cost the same as the first. The worst offence (and I know because I am guilty of it myself) is the use of a parking space by an employee or owner of a business. These spots are meant for customers. The biggest problem with parking tickets is that they can infuriate visitors or people who don’t believe in downtown giving it a chance.
Why not have the first parking ticket be graduated
1st ticket be a warning,
2nd ticket is $10
3rd ticket $20
4th ticket to be $30
5th ticket on to be $50
This is meant to be revenue neutral and not a tax
Tourists never get ticketed, occasional visitors pay a nominal $10 for their first two tickets which they cannot justify anger over.
The worst offenders, people who simply pay parking tickets as the cost of a convenient all day parking will see their tickets double and also have no reason to complain for the disrespect their actions show to merchants.
Now these are true parking solutions.
SPRAWL, ZONING
Mr. Van der Dolen shamelessly USED Mr Shanfield to support his position on unrestricted rezoning agricultural land for retail and office space. Well Mr. Van der Dolen, You claim we’ve tried fixes and they never work. Well, we’ve tried unrestricted rezoning of land to commercial and office space for decades and hows that been working out?
Mr. Van der Dolen, I think we should meet to see if I can stop your fierce opposition to our planning department. Their job is difficult enough without you’re unfounded criticism and campaign to misinform
***As an aside, one time I fought to install 3 additional parking spots in front of Chanoso’s and was told there was no space and that the streets island needed to remain. After heated debates with the city protesting that there was not enough space, I relented (not that I had much other choice). Only to see the bus stop moved from starbucks in front of my building hurting my business (I have no back alley and garbage is now a problem). I guess a bus takes up less space than a car in their world. Jack gave me an “I told you so” throughout this debate
Tags: Downtown, DWBIA, free parking, Parking, shanfield, van der dolen
Post Feedback
Mark, did you forget to comment on how he pays I think $64000/year in taxes with no parking. I have mentioned this before on this blog and you blew it off like it wasn’t one of or THE BIGGEST challenges to operating downtown. I am sure Mr. Shanfield has appealed probably every year and still doesn’t get relief. I agree with most everything Mr. Shanfield has said. The city needs to take less and stay away from Downtown and it will be better off. Joining the Landlord business is also a bad venture for the city, their record is attrocious. They have done way more damage than good.
Jason, the DWBIA has put your issue on its agenda and any info you can give to them may be helpful. The only time I’ve delved into this was 3 years ago and MPAC had a positive meeting telling me they have been granting almost every appeal.
You can agree all you want with everything Mr. Shanfield said, however, you’d also be in the category of fiercely opposition of what downtown needs
Jason, I don’t believe assessment takes into consideration parking spots. BTW, I Personally removed the unused bus stop sign in front of Jack Shanfields bldg getting him the two on street metered spots directly in front of his bldg.
I supported Jack and accompanied him several times to complain that they held those spots with no bus going there losing $15,000 per spot to the city for years.
Finally one sunday Morning I just took a wrench and removed them. I was questioned by someone and I admitted what I was doing. Chalk it up to civil disobedience.
Jason, all I can say is You don’t know Jack.
MArk B, if parking enforcement can’t do their job there are a lot of other companies that can. This is why I believe that parking should be outsourced (not garbage because we are getting the biggest bang for our buck with the city doing it).
Everyone likes to blame council and the mayor for all of the wrong-doing that goes on. Yes, much of it is deserved but not always. Yet everyone says adminstration follows council. However what isn’t being said is that administration can impede progress, dodge questions and be outright difficult to deal with at times.
One thng I have noticed in this city is that our administration is always saying what they can’t do instead of what they can do. I have never met so many negative people in all of my life. What seems to work elsewhere in many cities never seems to work here. We are not any different from anyone else yet we can’t look past our noses.
Refusal of Parking enforcement officers to chalk tires is what caused the mens shop to move. THis is because an accountant and someone from the massage service simply park their cars in front of his former shop of Ouellette and fed meters all day. I attended several of his complaint meetings with Parking enforcement, Barry said he complained about once per week for several years and gave up
Think about the graduated parking ticket proposal. I have been presented with no flaw yet
Dave, another solution could be to use technology. Instead of chalking tires, use smart meters and video technology to advice enforcement officers and enforce maximum time limiits.
Mark,
My mom will tell you and anyone else that wants to know - one of the worst things the city did to downtown businesses was “street-scaping”. Removing on-street parking from the length of Ouellette was a game-changer. A customer that just wanted to park and run into a store to quickly pick-up/drop-off was inconvenienced. One of the staples of my parent’s business was photo finishing. Pop-in drop off the film, come back, run-in to pick it up - maybe five minutes each time. As soon as that customer had to hunt for a parking spot the convenience was gone and so was the customer.
Also - keep in mind when reading VDD - he knows cars and represents car-centric thinking. He is “Happy-motoring” incarnate.
There was no net decrease in on street parking spaces. There was a shift from some locations to others only.
There’s no reason your parents cannot convert the nearest space to 15 minute parking, we did that with both spaces out front of Chanoso’s as we have no back alley for deliveries.
Ask Christina Tsizzard or Jim Yanchula to confirm how heated and vocal my attempts to increase on street parking were. To the point of jeopardizing the project itself.
But you know what, you also have no idea what streetscaping has brought.
NO streetscaping - NO tree lights (no plugs)
No streetscaping - NO Flowers (existing poles couldn’t support
NO Streetscapping - No consistent patio’s, instead we would have the mishmash of an obstacle course with some patio’s against the road and some against the street
INfrastructure was crumbling, we needed streetscape regardless. The only difference is that the DWBIA agreed to guidelines that increased beautification and walkability. I’m proud of the role I played which was less than the hard work of Past Chairs like Vicky Smith, Michael Duben, Ray Chu and currently Ron Balla. IF you could ever even realize the amount of hours put in by these volunteers.
Mark,
Our family business died in the 80’s recession. It was the initial street scaping that took away so much on-street parking. Look at the old pictures in the windows of all the empty storefronts. Parked cars (customers) lining the street from Riverside Drive to Wyandotte and sidewalks packed with people (customers).
Street-scaping was an attempt to create a mall experience along main streets. It was during a phase of “were going close roads and create outdoor malls”. It was dumb and it failed.
Go ask the old-timers that had businesses along Ouellette or Ottawa Street before street-scaping if they would rather have convenient parking out front for their customers or a tree and a bench?
As much as we want people to be less car-centric the reality is most people drive and we have to make allowances for cars.
Fair enough, when it comes to pre 2001, I don’t know Jack about Downtown.
I don’t even know what that streetscaping involved, but i’m sure many a heritage bldg was destroyed.
It wasn’t just about streetscaping. It was also about replacing crumbling infrastructure beneath the street. It was also about replacing a patch work of concrete and asphalt with a new concrete sidewalk. It was about replacing crumbling planters with new ones.
Vincent, is that like the asphalt poured over small cracks in stamped, coloured concrete? Or the asphalt poured onto existing pavers where there is a slight gap? How about the asphalt poured around a tree stump off to the side of the sidewalk?
The above are all in places where streescaping was done within the last 5 years.
I am certainly not arguing with you about the infratructure underneath the road. Killing 2 birds with one stone was a smart idea as was having new planters. But the city decided to go against some of the guidelines put in place by the DWBIA with reports that showed these were the wrong planters to build (not to mention how horrible they look).
I find it very interesting to see how nice the crosswalks that were installed on Riverside Dr and Crawford Ave as compared to the “new” streetscaping downtown. Those crosswalks are so much nicer than our “main street”. I find that very odd.
With regards to the above problems in the streetscaping I am surprised that the city hasn’t taken the construction company to court over the installation of the new streetscaping. ie cracking concrete, uneven pavers, trip areas etc.
Chris S,
It really is a difficult situation we find ourselves in. Until ALL levels of gov’t start working together to address the car issue we will all continue to pay higher levels of taxes whle shoveling that money into a fire pit.
Dave…
Our Traffic engineers aren’t even in the same building as the Urban Planners…yet alone on the same page.
“Vincent, is that like the asphalt poured over small cracks in stamped, coloured concrete? Or the asphalt poured onto existing pavers where there is a slight gap? How about the asphalt poured around a tree stump off to the side of the sidewalk?”
Dave, I don’t recall see anything like that along the portions of Ouellette Avenue between Wyandotte Street and Riverside Drive, and I walk up and down that portion of Ouellette almost every day. Where exactly are the paved tree stumps or asphalt patches on pavers on Ouellette? I’ll take a look on one of my lunch walks.
Stamped coloured concrete is not a feature of the recent Ouellette Ave reconstruction. That was done back in 2002 when Windsor hosted a G8 summit, including the intersection of Ouellette and Riverside. That intersection was NOT a part of the Ouellette Avenue reconstruction.
Soil and sand settle. The pavers can easily be relaid, so that is a minor issue in my mind.
Vincent,
I believe the asphalt it just shy of the corner of Chatham and Ouellette. So it may not be with the new design. (However, there are stamped sidewalks done within the last 10 years where asphalt is put in place over cracks or holes. It looks horribly tacky and cheap). Plus take a look at the concrete cracking in front of the Royal Bank on the same corner.
You are correct that the pavers settle but not to the degree they are right now. All it takes is one trip and teh city will be sued. We had pavers intalled at Gateway Public Park and didn’t have the settlement issue as seen on Ouellette. I have donepavers myself and not had it settle that much either (plus the gaps between some of the pavers).
You are also correct that the coloured crosswalks were part of the G8 summit in 2002. Out of curiousity, did Windsor pay tohave all that work done as I cannot remember.
I still can’t see why the coloured crosswalks couldn’t have been put back they looked quite nice as it does on the new crosswalks at Crawfod and Riverside Dr. It looks a heck of al ot better than asphalt and concrete.
Truthfully, the streetscaping looks like a dog’s breakfast and just as bland.
concentrate on density…eliminate the “need” for parking…parking should be a convenience, not a necessity because we destroyed our ability to live downtown without cars. There are more debates on what to do with these F…king things than there is debate on the “pedestrian environment” they violate.
I like the idea of the warning for the first parking notice. I used to live in windsor and hope to again one day if they are ever hiring. So I moved out of the city to a town where its free to park everywhere. You can park right on the streets downtown, and if those spots are taken, there are enough municipal parking lots on the next block over that you would never have a problem parking downtown unless it was a parade. Anyways since I never pay for parking when I go downtown in my new home, when I visited Windsor, I forgot that you put money in a machine to park. I got a ticket, and what a unfriendly way to welcome someone spending money into a struggling downtown. The fact that I drive 4 hours just to visit windsor downtown and speciality stores, should give me some relief when I forget to put a quarter in the parking machine.
‘Yet everyone says adminstration follows council. However what isn’t being said is that administration can impede progress, dodge questions and be outright difficult to deal with at times.”
And if you dodge the questions of your employer what happens to you?
Sorry - I agree to some extent that administration witholds information; or doesn’t present all alternatives. And we don’t know the reasons why - and can only speculate. Some of it, I would imagine is because of what I perceive to be a blurring of the lines between the CAO and Office of the Mayor.
But in the end it is up to council to demand such information.
I don’t get where you’re going with this?
The issue is
1. Merits of free parking
-sub-issue is the parking enforce.officers inability to consistently chalk tires
2. voluntariy compliance (officer must rip up ticket if newly written fi you smile and be nice.
3. graduated parking tickets
Maybe read the earlier comments as I quoted.
The real problem is that roads are for traffic (of all kinds) not for parking, which is an eyesore and an obstruction. Businesses in dense areas, and shopping malls, should be responsible for their own parking requirments, in the form of a garage (NOT a parking lot) on the same, or adjacent block. Use that vertical space. And, yes, it should be free to the customer. That’s just common sense, unless you’re next to a stadium or something. Upper levels can be gated off so they can be reserved for use solely by employees, owners, and residents.
Smart Parking Policy Makes a Difference, Even in Livable Streets Utopias
http://tinyurl.com/ycpc6q9
The evidence keeps mounting that smart parking policy is an essential tool in the fight to curb traffic. A new study of two German neighborhoods indicates that managing the supply of parking can make streets more livable, even in places that already have great infrastructure for transit, walking, and biking. Eliminating mandatory parking minimums, the data shows, plays an essential role in reducing driving.
Want to Foster Walking, Biking and Transit? You Need Good Parking Policy
http://tinyurl.com/ycpc6q9
The high-water mark for American parking policy came in the early 1970s, when cities including New York, Boston, and Portland set limits on off-street parking in their downtowns. They were compelled to do so by lawsuits brought under the Clean Air Act, which used the lever of parking policy to curb traffic and reduce pollution from auto emissions. This level of innovation went unmatched over the ensuing three-and-a-half decades. Only now are American cities implementing effective new parking strategies that cut down on traffic.
The REALITY is that on-street parking is a necessity here and in many North American cities.
We can ballyhoo all we want about having a pedestrian friendly area only or that roads are for travelling but that is not reality.
I have stated numerous times that the perception of little parking downtown is just that, a perception. However as James pointed out how many people, me included, just want to stop by a business quickly, get my stuff and go?
What the bog box stores and strip malls have over all downtowns is that they are easily accessible with easy parking. Even though at times it takes longer to walk from your parked car at the mall to your destination than it does downtown. The perception of “the mall” is the building itself, not the store in it.
Now as for streetscaping…yeesh. Who likes those big concrete bunkers that the trees sit in? Who likes these with only dirt inside them with some scraggly, almost non-existent shrubs?
I was told that they couldn’t plant anything in those planters because the tree roots were close to the surface of the dirt.
Perhaps our city should take a quick lesson and realize that hostas will live virtually anywhere with little to no dirt. So will Yucca plants and even boxwoods. Yet once again the “we can’t do that” mentality prevails.
I’m getting no where with city hall in fighting for better beautification downtown. It makes a person want to throw their hands in the air and just quit this city.
The trouble with this perception is its perception. If I want to stop quickly at the bank on Chatham and University, the farthest away I usually have to park is Pellisier, say 200 feet. If I want to stop quickly at Chapters at the Devonshire, the closest I can usually get is 5-8 cars plus the roadway in front of the mall, say 200 feet? If I want to stop quickly at the Canadian Tire on Walker, I say good luck - no chance at 200 feet.
Yet, many of the posters here assert without much evidence that the on street parking downtown is less “convenient” than the mall parking. I don’t agree.
The concrete bunkers that I also fought against were there to save trees that would have otherwise died.
Planters should be clad with mosaic tile art. That would change perception of them.
Nowhere with beautification? How about 100,000’s of tree lights and light standard lights, flowers.
We get plastic planters, not personally my favorite but its something.
I agree Dave for the most part.
I’ve been doing quite a lot of reading regarding the automobile, livability and what amounts to a general failure of governments in NA in addressing this issue.
I found a recent study done in Portland. The massive investments in public transporation have failed so far to increase ridership significantly, (something like .7% increase system wide); and has failed to contain sprawl.
So now governments are resorting to road diets and forced congestion - which still is not having a measurable impact - but it is having an impact on the environment and environmental stressors (poorer air quality; irritated drivers etc.).
Again, this isn’t saying NOT to invest in public transit, or find ways to encourage intensification; but realities, as you have stated, are ignored - which creates further unintended consequences.
PARKING IS AN ABSOLUTE NECESSITY.
Parking is a key component in the creation of “place”..it is the result of a need to be in a location, both historically and now, as a place of collected merchants. A place to park your horrse wagon, and sell your goods with others…and others know you’re there. This place grew from wagon to stand, to shelter, to store, to buildings to merchant genereated “downtown”. Parking and the shopping experience go hand and hand, you can’t have one without the other (the burbs know this big time). Its not an option, its a requirement and a basic standard principle of street design. The reason we have parking in our downtowns is to express the notion “you have arrived”…this is “the destination”…this is “the mall”…this is “where you get out of your car and walk”. For our city to remove parking from Ouelette is like saying we don’t understand the basic elements “civic and social pedestrian space”…we are telling the driver that we don’t want them to stop, we don’t want them to park and please be on your merry way to a place that is more convenient and understands your needs. It blows me away that the sub-urbs have been sucessful in adopting (stealing) basic urban principles, while our urban environment is failing at adopting the sub-urban attitude that a “moving” car is our biggest concern? Downtown is “the destination”…we are treating it “as a thoroughfair”…easy to speed thru- hard to stop. Street parking also adds an important safety buffer for pedestrians, parking visually finishes a street, offers a constant visual change and kinetic energy in large space that a few walking humans can’t.
That said, we should have to pay for parking, as we do, this keeps tenants, business folk and merchants from hogging spots all day. i do however, see a huge need for multiple quick stop (5 - 10 minute) free zones…it sucks to shuv a buck in a meter for only 5 minutes at the bank.
We do have parking downtown. Lots of it. We have so much that two parking garages went into receivership.
For the record, there is on-street parking on Ouellette plus some commercial vehicle drop-off/waiting lay-bys. Almost every east-west street has on-street parking metres away from Ouellette. So let’s just stop with this nonsense that there is no convenient on-street parking downtown.
Do we really want people driving downtown, popping into a store or office for five minutes, and then driving away? Or do we want people to walk around downtown on nice wide sidewalks, maybe pop into an outdoor patio for a drink and/or meal?
Who removed parking from Ouellette. Streetscapping caused some parking spots to be relocated but I was personally involved in the discussions that saw 5 to 7 spots added (to the best of my memory)
Of course there is lots of parking, our parking garages struggle for cars to fill them on weekdays. We also have plenty of on street parking spots by the Art Gallery that are unused. One wonders why we do not allow parking at the old bus terminal.
Whats contentious and needs to be clarified is the amount of nearby on street parking vs. off street parking
What been done for that is the DWBIA’s negotiations prevented parking fee rate increases in the garages and maintained one hour free parking to create a bigger gap in the rates. Should there be a bigger gap to incentivize parking in the garages? Probably, I’m assuming next time a rate increase is necessary, the parking garages will be left alone creating an even bigger gap
Vincent
Agreed, there is lots of parking…my statement is more of a concern of what happens when you remove it from a shopping street…there is a basic kit of parts that makes up the chemistry of a shopping street…my opinion is that ouelette has been majorly wounded in the latest “upgrades”…it is a ’shopping” street newly designed as a “thru- way”…it IS the destination…there is no need to hustle thru. If i tried to sell a client on an entire block of bland concrete with no textural changes, or if i suggested that it was actually ok to place 6 or 8 foot tall tiny trees on a “mature” street….or if i backed a seating bench a fott away from two lane traffic without a buffer.. .i wouldn’t be working. If people want to stop and run into a store that option should be there…if they want to sit in a cafe, that option should be there….parked cars offer an added sense of security.
Hey Mark, what is your opinion of the Freedom Festival moving to the arena parking lot or Farhi’s promised big announcement for downtown by the end of February. I know, I know, arena’s are so sterile looking. It would be a drag to have to look at if it was in our core.
Jason, of course its unfortunate that the festival must move for ONE year.
However some perspective is needed
Most of the outrage comes from this fueling conspiracy theory that the WFCU center will steel this for good. That is incorrect because:
The new festival stage is a game changer. This venue takes us from playing T-BALL to the Major leagues. When it is complete any festival featuring music will want to be there as well, I’m sure as luring new events.
We’re getting a professional stage and we’re preventing the dumping of raw sewage into our waterways for the first time and all we can focus on is the temporary relocation of a couple of festival/events for one year?
Much ado about nothing.
Could it have been moved to riverside drive. Maybe? I’m not a summerfest expert. I’m assuming the seniors in the apartment buildings would have fought against it as if it was the onset of bubonic plague threatening their grandchildren
Mark, to your list of solutions I would add better planning and management of off-street parking. Two big issues, as I see it, is the lack of signage directing motorist to preferred parking locations and the tons of little private lots that pepper the core without ryme or reason.
It is simple driving behavoir to focus at the street when driving. The many off-street lots simply don’t enter the driver’s mind map. Unless he/she is intending to go there. In Toronto the “Green P” signage help direct motorist to prefered off-street parking locations. The “Green P” lots in Toronto have another attractive feature, standard pricing and qaulity of service. Let’s face it, comparison shopping is something you should not be doing while driving downtown.
There has been a lot of great ideas presented here, in this thread. What we also need is a changing of the guard. A DWBIA that continues to put forward the same old “solutions” that are continually ignored by the city tells me that we need to fully clean house. A new mayor/council/and key administrators coupled with a fresh crop of innovators and forward thinkers on the DWBIA.
As an example, the sole issue of parking, the city removes on street parking and some on the BIA call for more walkibility while shunning the automobile. Give me a break.
What same old “solutions” do you speak of
The DWBIA Board has an ongoing change, Newest additions to marketing committee are Adriano Ciotoli from Windsor Eats and Tom Lucier from Phog. Thats about as progressive change as you get
I’m on the DWBIA and I’ve just presented 2 changes here that I think are pretty forward thinking. 1. Voluntary compliance and 2. graduated parking fines
Streetscaping complaints about replacing parking spots are from 30 years ago, I was only 13 yrs old.
The DWBIA dropped the ball 5 years ago (no current board members were part of that) on wayfinding signage. Taken advantage of by consultants. there’s an entire story to that.
No one on the BIA has shunned the automobile. However, successful downtowns are pedestrian friendly luring residents and becoming its own neighborhood.
P.S. I also get frustrated when developers and politicians throw out announcement deadlines and we see months pass after those dates.
Crossing my fingers, who knows?
As a P.S. L.O.S. when I rejoined the DWBIA after an absence I voiced my willingness to step aside to make room for new blood as I would agree with you that its always necessary to change the guard. The Past Chair, however plays an important role in remembering why things were done in the first place. Remembering our history, so we don’t doom ourselves to repeating it
No one on any of the discussions has remembered why Summerfest was moved off riverside drive. I feel bad for seniors that they worry for their peace of mind again after such hard fought battles to have festival plaza built in the first place